Mother Shipton, also known as Ursula Sonthiel Shipton, was born in 1488 in Yorkshire, England, and lived until 1561. According to legend, her birth was the result of a union between her mother and the devil. When she was born, she was hideously ugly, and as she grew older she began to tell fortunes and predict the future. It is said that she predicted the invention of trains and the telegraph.
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'Mother Shiopton's prophecies are hoaxes' Can you prove that catagorically in order to make such a statment, without using words like, apparently and seemingly? The first known compilation of her life and prophecies was printed in 1641, 80 years after her death, so? Why does that make it a hoax? How long after the death of Christ was the Bible written, about 500 years? 'Not heard of outside Yorkshire'? There are references to her from all parts of England, London,Portsmouth, Somerset, Wales, Norfolk. There are Yorkshire historians who have researched tirelessly to prove she didn't exist, they have concluded that indeed she must have but are unable to confirm the authenticity of her prophecies. It's easy to question the accuracy of events and prophecies that took place so long ago. That does not make it a hoax. Making a potentially damaging statment without proof is liabless. Do you have proof or just opinions in which case I recommend you change the wording of your website. Certainly on this occasion, you are the hoaxers. stating as fact that which is not, and which you have no proof. Perhaps you could let me have the name of the Directors of your 'museum' and address to pass on to my lawyers. Adrian Sayers - Owner, Moither Shipton's Cave
Posted by Adrian Sayers in Knaresborough, Yorkshire on Fri Oct 22, 2004 at 08:46 AM
Oh dear! I just read Adrian Sayers remarks, and I have to say they rather make me dispair. He misses a major point. If he wishes to maintain that "Mother Shipton" was an historical figure, it is for him to prove that this is the case, not the other way round. I can easliy invent "historical" characters - does that mean they exist? No, of course it doesn't. Mother Shipton was the invention of one of the many writers of prophecies that flourished from the seventeenth to the nineteenth centuries. And I fear that then, as now, truth gives way to greed, and a good story is more important than honesty. Remember, if you make extraordinary claims, you'd better have extraordinary evidence to support it. And the story of Mother Shipton is extraordinary. And how much proof is there for her existence? As far as I am aware, none. Another point - if Shipton's prophecies are genuine, how come there are different versions? Hm. Enough time wasted on this subject, I think.
Posted by Simon Walker on Mon Dec 13, 2004 at 10:48 AM
Mother shipton is a hoakes because history quotes people wrote these predictions after they happened.
Posted by Josh Pye in leeds on Mon Jan 17, 2005 at 10:55 AM
In reponse to Simon Walkers self righteous nonsense; If he can invent a historical character like Mother Shipton then he must also write 50 books under different names spanning five centuries. I can't prove she existed, but historical evidence and the weight of probability is that she did, her name was recorded even in Samuel Pepys' diaries. Of course her story and her prophecies have been embelished over the years, but that doesn't make her a hoax or a deceiver, or come to that me either as Simon is suggesting. According to Simon Walker's criteria, Jesus can't have existed and the Bible must be a hoax. Its all to easy on the internet to anonomously make spurious allegations. I am still waiting for the names and addresses of the creaters of this liabless rubbish. I assume Simon that you are connected to 'the museum' poking fun at things in order to make a living is sad but harmless, but be careful lest you go too far.
Posted by adrian Sayers on Sat Mar 12, 2005 at 08:06 AM
how can you prove that she was faking all other peoples work and you have nothing about the supposed witch group she belonged to how is it that people know so much about her when you werent even there when she was alive
Posted by Lara in Bunbury on Sun May 01, 2005 at 06:42 PM
Well this site is just typically what one would expect from anti pagan, tunnel visioned Christians. Honestly "Scott Wallis' heart reaching the nations of this world with the message of Christ's love till Jesus comes" (not to mention the 25 dollars for the books poised right beneath his beaming picture), or the fact that he's only interested in his own/'God's' prophesies. Mother Shipton told a few prophesies, so what. Jesus Christ was the most awesome prophet/magician that ever lived, just because He's described as a prophet and not the Son of God in every manuscript other than your new testament I'm sure that you won't let that put you off. Don't believe everything you read!
Posted by Carly Day in Leeds, Yorkshire, England on Tue May 03, 2005 at 05:12 PM
whoa. we really missed something here. actually 2/3 of the bible was writen before jesus - as for the rest, the new testament, it was completed by 100 a.d. or even earlier, when there were eyewitnesses to the accounts recorded. not that its relevant, but lets at least get the facts straight.
Posted by Kirstin on Fri May 13, 2005 at 03:11 PM
Here is one of the many sources debunking the Mother Shipley hoax: http://www.stormfront.org/rpo/PRDCTPST.htm This site is anti-prophecy and anti-Christian, but they seem to have done their homework. Here is another, quite extensive: http://www.sacred-texts.com/pro/msi/ In regard to the analogy of the Bible being compiled long after the fact, the original New Testament documents were being circulated, copied and kept as references up until the time the Bible was codified. The Old Testament accounts were being shared by an entire race of people, each person acting as a check on the veracity of all the others. Then all the accounts were codified and carefully preserved with a system of strict checks. All the documents, as far as I can see, touting Mother Shipman's prophecies have been put together after the fact, and the incidents of fraud found out and recorded. Mother Shipman's history and written record is almost as solid as that concerning the legend of King Arthur, and that's not too solid. I'm not a registered member and you don't say where to type in the "word you see below" as I am instructed to do. I see the word Smileys and have typed it in this sentence. I hope this posts. Have a good day.
Posted by John Davis in Oregon on Sun Jul 03, 2005 at 04:50 PM
Can I recommed Knaresborough historian Arnold Kellett's Mother Shipton Witch and Prophetess, available from Amazon.co.uk at about £8. As far as I know it's the only in-depth, serious book about her. He shows that, as stated here, the first reference in print is in 1641, about 80 years after she is meant to have died and the first detailed account of her legendary birth and life, including the first mention of her coming from Knaresborough, was in Richard Head's book of 1667 ( also republished in 1684). He says her alleged prophecy about how Cardinal Wolsey, Archbishop of York, would see York but never arrive there (he was arrested for treason on his way in about 1530) was probably what she was best known for in the mid 17th century, at which point she was said to be well-known in the oral tradition among York townsfolk as a prophet to whom various sayings were attributed. Her fame may also have spread because it seems she was believed to have predicated the fire of LOndon in 1666, following which Head cashed in with his book. Her best-known sayings today, including verses prophesying railways or cars, modern communication, iron boats etc , and the end of the world (originally in 1881), have seemingly been clearly proven to be 19th century forgeries by someone called Charles Hindley. Apparently mention of her living in, or as it is now, being born in, the cave near the Dropping Well in Knaresborough, is not made in any sources until about the start of the last century, even though the well itself has been a popular attraction since the 17th C. It all adds up to a colourful local legend, but we don't seem to know much for sure. Kellett concludes he believes there was a Yorkshire woman who told fortunes and made predictions who formed the basis for the later stories, but we can't say a lot more.
Posted by OR in UK on Sun Aug 14, 2005 at 04:24 PM
I'm not sure who is doing the hoaxing and who is being hoaxed. Makes sense to me that Mother S. was a pretty unattractive baby, girl, and woman. Makes sense to me that she fell into the profession everyone thought she was good at...telling fortunes...And good for her if she predicted trains and telegraphs. Da Vinci predicted gliders and aircraft. So did The Mahabharata, for that matter. But somehow I doubt the devil was her dad.....
Posted by Grace in Maryland on Sun Sep 04, 2005 at 04:11 PM
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