(Leftwing, this is actually called �Lucid Dreaming� )Actually, no it isn’t. I have lucid dreams quite often, and know it is just that when it happens.

Leftwing

In fact, as was noticed by researchers as long ago as 1976, very many people who report OBEs also turn out to have lucid dreams quite frequently. Also these same people have more than the average number of flying and falling dreams, and are more likely to have experienced other unusual sleep phenomena like false awakenings and sleep paralysis.

So people who have a lot of unusual dreams are more likely to have had an OBE…

...I wonder why that would be?!

leftwing - 24 May 2007 10:34 PM

(Leftwing, this is actually called �Lucid Dreaming� )Actually, no it isn’t. I have lucid dreams quite often, and know it is just that when it happens.

Leftwing

Yes, this is lucid dreaming and there is quite a lot about this online.  There are also some forums you may be interested in.

http://www.lucidity.com/LucidDreamingFAQ2.html#OBE

1.3   HOW ARE LUCID DREAMS RELATED TO OUT-OF-BODY EXPERIENCES (OBEs)?
A mysterious and highly controversial phenomenon sometimes occurs in which people experience the compelling sensation that they have somehow “left their bodies.” The “out-of-body experience” or “OBE”, as this fascinating phenomenon is usually termed, takes a variety of forms. In the most typical, you are lying in bed, apparently awake, when suddenly you experience a range of primarily somatic sensations, often including vibrations, heaviness, and paralysis. Then you experience the vivid sensation of separating from your “physical body” in what feels like a second body, often floating above the bed.

It is important to note the distinction between the phenomenal reality of the OBE and the various interpretations of the experience. What is really happening when you feel yourself “leaving your body”? According to one school of thought, what is actually happening is just what it feels like: you are moving in a second body out of and away from your physical body—in physical space. But this “explanation” doesn’t hold up very well under examination. After all, the body we ordinarily feel ourselves to be (or if you like, to inhabit) is a phenomenal or mental body rather than a physical body. The space we see around us is not physical space as “common sense” tells us, but as modern psychology makes clear, a phenomenal or mental space. In general, our consciousness is a mental model of the world.

OBE enthusiasts promote lucid dreaming as a “stepping stone” to the OBE. Conversely, many lucid dreamers have had the experience of feeling themselves “leave the body” at the onset of a lucid dream. From a laboratory study, we have concluded that OBEs can occur in the same physiological state as lucid dreams. Wake-initiated lucid dreams (WILDs) were three times more likely to be labeled “OBEs” than dream initiated lucid dreams. If you believe yourself to have been awake, then you are more likely to take the experience at face value and believe yourself to have literally left your physical body in some sort of mental or “astral” body floating around in the “real” physical world. If, on the other hand, you think of the experience as a dream, then you are likely to identify the OBE body as a dream body image and the environment of the experience as a dream world. The validity of the latter interpretation is supported by observations and research on these phenomena. “

Here’s a good forum:  http://www.dreamviews.com/community/#20024)

You know, I’m actually pretty good at inducing lucid dreams when I want to.  I haven’t really done it in a while, but about a year ago, I was really into it and was doing it several nights a week, just for the kicks.

  (Leftwing, this is actually called �Lucid Dreaming�)

I thought I answered the above, but must have had too much Brandy.

No. lucid dreaming is not it. I have lucid dreams often, sometimes prophetic ones. It’s one thing to know you’re dreaming, wake up and remember everything just like it had actually happened, and another to Astral travel. However, it has to be experienced to be understood. T. Lobsang Rampa’s books ‘You Forever’ and ‘Beyond the Tenth’ give simple instructions on how to experience it should anyone be interested.

Leftwing

              (Yes, this is lucid dreaming and there is quite a lot about this online.  There are also some forums you may be interested in.)

Didn’t mean to repeat myself.

From what I read in your post, it seems to me the writer(s) could only theorize because they had never experienced the true OBE. I could relate some stories here that even I wouldn’t believe if they hadn’t happened to me…with conscious effort…but will forego that pleasure as they are part of one or another of my books.
However, check out what Duke University has to say on the subject. As a matter of fact they even even experiment with astral projection.

Leftwing

Info stuff:

Near Death Experiences
Near-death experiences (NDE) are among the most powerful experiences that a person can have.
When people survive a close brush with death, either because of an accident or maybe because of a heart failure, the experience is known as Near-death experiences (NDEs). One most extraordinary aspect of NDEs is that the underlying pattern seems unaltered by a person’s culture or belief system, religion, race, education, or any other known variable.

A person who has had an NDE normally reports being out of the Physical body, hearing buzzing or ringing sounds, moving through a dark tunnel, encountering deceased loved ones, seeing beautiful scenes and colors, hearing angelic music, feeling peaceful and at Home, learning lessons, and an indescribable radiant light full of love and affection. After this brief experience, they are told that it’s not yet time to stay on the Other Side, and they rapidly journey back into the constraints of the now resuscitated physical body.

For most people the experience is joyful beyond words. The subject sometimes ‘hears’ the doctor pronouncing him dead when he feels intensely alive and free from physical pain. They often recount events that occurred during the period of unconsciousness with complete accuracy.

Tens of thousands of NDE cases are now on record by doctors and scientists. All these cases demonstrate a continuation of awareness beyond “death”.

(Tens of thousands of NDE cases are now on record by doctors and scientists. All these cases demonstrate a continuation of awareness beyond “death”. )

I had the experience of ‘The Light at the Bottom of the Well, or at the ‘End of the Tunnel’. I almost made it there, but my parents were told I was dying, so brought a minister to the hospital to baptise me. When he dropped the water on my forehead it burned! The sensation brought me back from my descent to the light. I gave my Dad a dirty look for allowing the minister to do that to me.
He laughed, I got better, and have regretted it ever since!
I was seven years old.

I wonder if that is why I do not believe in orthodox religions? I believe in the Godself only. Nothing exterior.

Tim is right, though: astral projection is not only possible, it happens with, or without, conscious effort.

Leftwing

Thank you Leftwing for your input on this topic,

Tim

To whom it may concern,
When you think about my topic, you might want to think outside the box.
Exactly what is ‘Thinking Outside the Box’?
Outside the Box
Thinking outside the box requires different attributes that include:
Willingness to take new perspectives to day-to-day work.
Openness to do different things and to do things differently.
Focusing on the value of finding new ideas and acting on them.
Striving to create value in new ways.
Listening to others.
Supporting and respecting others when they come up with new ideas.

Out-of-the box thinking requires an openness to new ways of seeing the world and a willingness to explore. Out-of-the box thinkers know that new ideas need nurturing and support. They also know that having an idea is good but acting on it is more important. Results are what count
http://www.canadaone.com/ezine/april02/out_of_the_box_thinking.html
Thank you,
Tim

Out-of-the box thinking requires an openness to new ways of seeing the world and a willingness to explore. Out-of-the box thinkers know that new ideas need nurturing and support. They also know that having an idea is good but acting on it is more important. Results are what count.

Sounds a lot like science.