I wish we could redo that original episode,since new information has surfaced which shows that Melvin Harris really botched the work records of Stephenson/D’onston…in particular where he claims D’onston contracted venereal disease ( false) cavorted with prostitutes ( false ) as well as other facts regarding the man. Speaking for Mike,I appreciate that you did listen to the Rippercast program and agree that Stan Russo, a personal friend of mine, is one of the outstanding thinkers in the field.
To be perfectly honest,Kol…I’m not certain as to the identity of the woman in Millers Court was, although most in the field are pretty sure it was MJK. One thing that has made me think twice about who was in the room are the Inquest statements/depositions of Mrs. Maxwell and Maurice Lewis who claim that they saw her on the morning (Nov.9th) alive and not so necessarily well…but nonetheless alive. According to the mainstream, she had already been dead for hours. Thats one of the many “mysteries within the mystery” of the Whitechapel Murders Case.
Dave B:
Buddy, I’m nonplussed. Here I come over,all ready to contribute what I can in a nice way and share some ideas… and whammo ! I encounter someone I never thought I would…. A bigger and more obnoxious prick than I am…you. I think thats a pretty mean feat…..or is it “feet” ? ; )
I only meant that I was that Howard Brown being referred to in posts prior to my joining the site.
Oh. Shame, I thought we had a celebrity join us.
whomever Jack The Ripper was, he or they( !) definitely had an impact on the police,press,people and politics of that age which has carried over to this one in one way or the other. The Ripper didn’t necessarily influence the age he lived in as much as he would future generations.
Some examples would be nice, since his ‘influence’ otherwise seems to consist mainly of books about him and cameo appearances in a number of films/novels of varied worth (he even turned up on Babylon 5, I seem to recall).
(BTW, ‘whomever’ is the objective case but kudos for knowing the word existed.)
Dave, in the pantheon of characters ( and there are some very unique critters in the field), within the field of Ripperology…and I mentioned their “fascinating” qualities only within the context of Ripperology. I suppose one would have to be as passionate towards Ripperology to understand how I meant “fascinating”.
Fair enough. If biologists can get excited about the caecal valves of lizards, I’m sure finding Roslyn O’Donton fascinating is allowed.
Actually the Ripper killings triggered a major change in British policing and among other things saw Scotland Yard try undercover stings (unsuccessful but not previously well-used in British policing) and a much larger role for women in the service, paving the way for WPCs later. Policing really improved its methods due to the Ripper.
Also he marks one of the first ‘cocky’ killers, contacting and mocking the police, which was previously unheard of but is now not all that uncommon in serial killers. Quite possibly the Ripper was the Black Sabbath that influenced all the heavy metal that followed.
Actually the Ripper killings triggered a major change in British policing and among other things saw Scotland Yard try undercover stings (unsuccessful but not previously well-used in British policing) and a much larger role for women in the service, paving the way for WPCs later. Policing really improved its methods due to the Ripper.
That seems a bit post hoc. Police methods certainly improved, but that does not mean it was because of JTR. Police methods were also improving before him, CID had been formed ten years prior to the JTR case, followed by the Special Branch five years later. Why credit the ripper case with improvements like fingerprinting and WPCs and not include radio cars and DNA profiling?
The use of fingerprinting seems to owe more to Sir Edward Henry, who had been tutored by Francis Galton the first English scientist to scientifically study fingerprints. One of Henry’s first acts on becoming Assistant Commissioner of the Metropolitan Police was to introduce fingerprinting.
Buddy, I’m nonplussed. Here I come over,all ready to contribute what I can in a nice way and share some ideas… and whammo ! I encounter someone I never thought I would…. A bigger and more obnoxious prick than I am…you. I think thats a pretty mean feat…..or is it “feet” ? ; )
For what, asking you to provide an example or two and not just taking your word for it?
It’s very nice of you to share your ideas, I’m sure. How about some supporting evidence?
I became interested in the field of Ripperology as a direct result of being involved in the paranormal. I had always had an interest in the field and in 2006, diagnosed with a critical heart condition I was forced out of work. Rather than sit on my backside doing nothing, I decided that I would write a book on the paranormal, a task which drew my attnetion to the fact that several previously named Ripper Suspects had links to my hometown of Hull.
I’m sorry, but I’m not seeing the connection between Ripperology and paranormal.
Maybe the member of your site who showed up on National Treasure Book of Secrets Secret History of the Freemasons could further explain why he doesn’t believe in the Masonic angle.
Philip Hutchinson has already appeared on the show (Episode 7 ‘The Tour Guide From Hell’). You may get a better idea of his views from listening to that episode.
I do plan on doing an episode entitled ‘Conspiracy A Go-Go’. Stay tuned.
Actually the Ripper killings triggered a major change in British policing and among other things saw Scotland Yard try undercover stings (unsuccessful but not previously well-used in British policing) and a much larger role for women in the service, paving the way for WPCs later. Policing really improved its methods due to the Ripper.
That seems a bit post hoc. Police methods certainly improved, but that does not mean it was because of JTR. Police methods were also improving before him, CID had been formed ten years prior to the JTR case, followed by the Special Branch five years later. Why credit the ripper case with improvements like fingerprinting and WPCs and not include radio cars and DNA profiling?
The use of fingerprinting seems to owe more to Sir Edward Henry, who had been tutored by Francis Galton the first English scientist to scientifically study fingerprints. One of Henry’s first acts on becoming Assistant Commissioner of the Metropolitan Police was to introduce fingerprinting.
I’m sorry, where do I mention fingerprinting? I didn’t mention it once. It has nothing to do with the Ripper. Please don’t put words in my mouth.
The police used arned, armoured female officers, undercover as whores, as bait in sting operations designed to draw the killer out. This was the first time a British police force used female officers like this (previously male officers dressed as women were sometimes used, I kid you not) so this marked the first serious, risk to life and limb work given to women in the force. It became regular practice thereafter and is a milestone in police use and attitude towards women, paving the way for WPCs to come along.
The Whitechapel murders brought attention to the plight of the poor in the East End where meetings, demonstrations, strikes and humanitarian activism had failed for decades. Up until the Ripper’s crimes, the working poor and destitute were really ‘Outcast’ London. Because the Ripper scare sent a wave of terror throughout the whole of London, and Great Britain, and those in the West End did not feel immune to the crimes, after the Autumn of terror subsided social improvements and reforms in the East End were instituted. Slum clearance, model housing for the poor, night shelters for ‘unfortunates’, and gas lighting on the side streets and alleyways (which Queen Victoria personally ordered) were all improvements brought about as a direct result of the Ripper murders. Tenement buildings rose where the slums and lodging houses used by the victims once stood. In 6 years, Jack the Ripper had done more to destroy the Flower and Dean St. rookery than fifty years of road building, slum clearance, police pressure, Poor law Guardians, vestires and sanitary officers. ‘Jack the Ripper’ forever altered the way that the politicians, press and the public treated crime in the East End by for the first time linking its poverty and violence together. The Ripper’s crimes also helped create a feeling of ‘One London’, in which the West End riches were utilized to help those of the East End, and this division between the rich and the poor, West and East, shouldered some of the blame in the crimes.
So, these are just a few examples of how the Whitechapel murders forever physically and psychologically altered the city of London and its inhabitants.
If anyone cares to debate this point, I suggest reading a few books first.
Philip Hutchinson has already appeared on the show (Episode 7 ‘The Tour Guide From Hell’)....I do plan on doing an episode entitled ‘Conspiracy A Go-Go’. Stay tuned.
JM
Thanks Jonathan for the reply and I’ll be sure to tune in to a future conspiracy episode with the hope it’s not just about the Royal Conspiracy. There are many other versions that go undiscussed. Stan Russo will talk about a non-Mason leaving a message for a Mason but no one else. And nobody will talk about the conspiracy being only after the individual murders, in the cover-up of these embarassing Masonic messages, etc. Forget about the possibility of a child of a Mason by an Irish prostitute and Ripper victim, or her friend, and the birth initiating a cover-up which may inadvertantly have prevented catching the murderer. Conspiracy theories don’t die with Prince Eddy’s alibis anymore than Roslyn’s significance, with his.
I’m sorry, where do I mention fingerprinting? I didn’t mention it once. It has nothing to do with the Ripper. Please don’t put words in my mouth.
Where did I put words in your mouth? I never said that you said fingerprinting was a result of the Ripper case, I merely listed some of the improvements to police methods that followed it. Fingerprinting was singled out as the one of my examples that might be linked to the Ripper case, I just assumed no-one actually believes radio-cars and DNA testing result from it.
The police used arned, armoured female officers, undercover as whores, as bait in sting operations designed to draw the killer out. This was the first time a British police force used female officers like this (previously male officers dressed as women were sometimes used, I kid you not) so this marked the first serious, risk to life and limb work given to women in the force. It became regular practice thereafter and is a milestone in police use and attitude towards women, paving the way for WPCs to come along.
The Whitechapel murders brought attention to the plight of the poor in the East End where meetings, demonstrations, strikes and humanitarian activism had failed for decades. [...] Slum clearance, model housing for the poor, night shelters for ‘unfortunates’, and gas lighting on the side streets and alleyways (which Queen Victoria personally ordered) were all improvements brought about as a direct result of the Ripper murders.
Really, and not a consequence of say unionisation, particularly among dock workers?
According to Law and Society in England 1750-1950 by Cornish and Clark, the slum problem only began to be properly addressed when the 1881-1882 Select Committee became involved, and when the Marquis of Salisbury took it up as a Tory cause before a Royal Commission (1884-1885).
‘Jack the Ripper’ forever altered the way that the politicians, press and the public treated crime in the East End by for the first time linking its poverty and violence together.
Perry Curtis, in Jack the Ripper and the London Press, wrote that the prevailing view of the East End was one of a crime and disease-ridden sprawl, one where the Ripper case, however shocking, was unsurprising. This was a view frequently exaggerated by the press for dramatic effect.
So, these are just a few examples of how the Whitechapel murders forever physically and psychologically altered the city of London and its inhabitants. If anyone cares to debate this point, I suggest reading a few books first.
In most mainstream history books, Jack the Ripper is little more than a footnote. Ripperology books may contend that he was of pivotal importance, but as far as I can see this is just bare assertion.
