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Hidalgo/Frank T. Hopkins
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Posted By:
Bob Schroeck
Nov 24, 2004
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I've been a long-time reader of the Museum site and have enjoyed it greatly. Now finally comes my chance to offer something back! (Assuming, of course, the search mechanism for the forums isn't broken and I'm not repeating someone's earlier suggestion...)
In the wake of renting the 2003 Disney/Touchstone movie "Hidalgo" (billed as a "true story"), I wanted to learn more about Frank Hopkins and his achievements. Google led me right away to the following site:
http://www.thelongridersguild.com/hopkins.htm
A thoroughly documented set of pages and links that show that the "true" story of Frank Hopkins is not just a hoax, but apparently so blatant a fabric of falsehoods that some historians are wondering how or why anyone believes it. Especially telling are the Buffalo Bill museum disclaiming any knowledge of Hopkin's alleged "starring roles" in Cody's Wild West Show, and the Arab historians who not only state authoritatively that the so-called "Ocean of Fire" race Hopkins claims to have won never existed, but also point out that any "3000-mile" race in the Middle East would have to have its finish line somewhere in Eastern Europe...
Looks like a perfect topic to cover in the Museum!
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Comments
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Page 10 of 13 pages ‹ First < 8 9 10 11 12 > Last › |
Stephen Shehane
in Fallon, Nevada
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Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 | 05:46 AM
Just watching in M,
YOU ARE CORRECT!!!!! I am an old fart that just hates people that try to destroy others dreams and when it comes to destroying an old man in the grave I fight like hell!!!! NO ONE DESERVES TREATMENT LIKE THAT!!! |
Frederic
in San Angelo, Texas
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Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 | 11:05 AM
Stephen, I totally agree with what you said. The one thing I've learned about the horse community, regardless of breed, is that there are cliques, and if you're not part of a certain clique, there's going to be smack talk and back-stabbing. |
Stephen Shehane
in Fallon, Nevada
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Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 | 03:34 PM
Fredric,
I do not care what the blood line of a horse is, the horse is what is important not the people that try to show "their" superiority. The animal (horse) deserves the love and respect of those they have served for hundreds and even thousands of years, no matter what the breed.
In all sincerity, that is all I have been trying to say on this blog.
Leave the old man in the grave and let the horse he championed live on.
Stephen |
god damn
in ...
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Posted: Sat Jun 26, 2010 | 12:26 PM
*YOU ARE CORRECT!!!!! I am an old fart that just hates people that try to destroy others dreams and when it comes to destroying an old man I fight like hell!!!! NO ONE DESERVES TREATMENT LIKE THAT!!!*
Take it easy, calm down. You are all excited. |
Stephen Shehane
in Fallon, Nevada
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Posted: Sat Jun 26, 2010 | 04:13 PM
To God Damn In...
Thank you sincerely, you are probably correct however just so you know, I have always been passionate when it came to standing up to someone taking advantage of another especially when the person being wronged was not able to take care of him or herself. It is just who I am, hate me, love me or reject me, I am who and what I am and I will always stand up for the one being trampled on. (Gosh that is what our country used to be all about) or at least that is what I thought our country was all about.
Anyway, thanks for your comment, it really meant a great deal to me to see someone simply saying "take it easy". Keep Riding and take care of all the horses!!! They deserve our love and respect! |
Bill Womack
in south west hills
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Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 | 06:16 PM
I am looking for others the Codey museum has turned away. There is a big hole in Codey's story. I found that the records of Codey's employment burned very close to when the Marshal records at Paris Texas and Fort Smith Arkansas burned. This seems to have been some what selective fires in the record departments. I do not care about someones personal wrongs or tall tails. I just want to find why some of the early Codey demonstrators are treated as though they never happened. Please no crap or resentment comments. Looking for the truth. |
Stephen Shehane
in Fallon, Nevada
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Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 | 06:26 PM
Bill,
There is a web site coming back on line by friends and family of the people that Hopkins worked with. I hope very much that the old man and lady are still living but if not their children and grandchildren are. I will do what I can to help you as I would love to see some of the smugness put to rest. email me anytime .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address).
I am no flake just check me out on line H. Stephen Shehane (I wrote none of the listing or postings). |
sapphire
in ...
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Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 | 12:03 PM
If you want information on Hopkins, this is the place to go.
http://www.thelongridersguild.com/hopkins.htm |
Stephen Shehane
in Fallon, Nevada
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Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 | 01:47 PM
Sapphire,
Thank you but I have recently found out that even Cody's Museum does not have accurate records.
I have hopefully stated my stance that I really do not care how many the lies the old man told what I truly care about is the fact that he did, no question about it, champion the Mustang Horse... I am not stuck on Mustangs, I am stuck on horses. Any person that will champion a horse cannot be all bad, at least in my book.
The horse has served mankind for at least 2,500 years or more. We as the "human" owe it to them to protect them and give the respect they deserve as they have done nothing except serve us when called upon.
Hon, that is all I have truly been trying to say in my postings. OK, off my soap box.
I am certain the old man Hopkins lied like hell and made up stories, so what there are very few old men that have not made up big tales and yarns that had very little to do with what was true, the fact is the old man did stick up for the Mustang. Thanks for your information. Stephen |
Stephen Shehane
in Fallon, Nevada
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Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 | 05:15 PM
Check out this link: This controversy has been going on for years but there must be something to the tales of his being a endurance racing champion and Hildalgo was apparently real:
Link.
Link shortened by Moderator. |
Stephen Shehane
in Fallon, Nevada
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Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 | 05:22 PM
IF the link did not work just google American Heritage Center at the University of Wyoming the search for Frank T. Hopkins...I think all of you including myself will be shocked at the letters and correspondence you find from, on and about Hopkins. I am thinking if the old man was still alive he might have a great liable case against long distance race association as well as Buffalo
Bill's museum but from what I have seen he did not care about anything but the Mustang. Don't just read one letter, read all of them and get educated...Sure the man probably blew his stories so out of proportion that they were too far fetched to be 100% true but hey he told them they are here but guess what SO IS THE MUSTANG! |
sapphire
in ...
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Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 | 01:45 PM
He wouldn't have any *libel* case; in fact, not only would Hopkins lose big, he'd probably have to pay the other side's court costs. |
Stephen Shehane
in Fallon, Nevada
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Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 | 01:52 PM
In order to prove libel it is my understanding that all that has to be proven is that the person "writing" has intent to inflict harm or to discredit with intent to inflict harm and defamation. Think about it. Again, I do not care if the old man did anything, I think he did but as he got older the stories grew with the telling, I have known many old men that have done this, SO WHAT, the one simple fact is Hopkins did work with horses and he did champion the mustang and for that fact alone, I am a fan. He cannot defend himself, so here I sit defending someone I never met simply because of 2 reasons 1st he did champion the American Horse and 2nd he is dead and in the grave and cannot defend himself. If you stood up for any breed of horse and got slammed like this old man, hell I would defend you. The horse is what is important. The horse has served mankind for centuries it is our turn to serve them! OK, I am off my soap box. |
Stephen Shehane
in Fallon, Nevada
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Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 | 02:14 PM
Sapphire, I am honestly not trying to argue but thought this would be good for you to read. Again, my real desire is to defend someone that stood up for the horse and cannot defend himself. I do not care if his tall tales were so blown out of proportion that they became nothing but tall tales.
Definition of libel: use of print or pictures to harm someone's reputation. Until 1964, a person could prove that they had been libeled simply by showing that the statements in question were incorrect. In 1964, the Supreme Court decided that public officials had to prove that the statements in question were made with "actual malice"-for the purpose of harming the person's reputation. As a result of the Supreme Court case, Time, Inc. v. Firestone (1976); private individuals only have to prove negligence, rather than "actual malice," on the part of the press. A malicious publication expressed either in print or in writing, or by pictures, effigies, or other signs, tending to expose another to public hatred, contempt, or ridicule. Such publication is indictable at common law. Published material meeting three conditions: The material is defamatory either on its face or indirectly; The defamatory statement is about someone who is identifiable to one or more persons; and, The material must be distributed to someone other than the offended party; i.e. published; distinguished from slander. A publication which is calculated to injure the reputation of another by exposing him to hatred, contempt or ridicule. As one can see, the legal definition of libel revolves around the maliciousness of the act and the harm it has caused. The act of libel, according to the law, has to be in written or visual form such as an article or photograph and has to somehow damage the reputation of a person or business in some way where the courts are the natural place to resolve the claims. |
sapphire
in ...
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Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 | 05:02 PM
Like I said, Frank Hopkins, if he were here today, wouldn't have a case for libel against anybody who called him on his BS. |
Stephen Shehane
in Fallon, Nevada
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Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 | 09:41 PM
Sapphire,
Whatever, I again do not want to fight with you but I think he very well could have a case but the fact in my mind is even if he did not have a case he did love the horse and as far as I am concerned that gives him great leeway for making any tall tale he wants. Enjoying the bantering but honestly only truly care about the horses. I sincerely hope you have a wonder week. |
dan walker
in indiana
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Posted: Sun Aug 15, 2010 | 05:26 AM
after watching hidalo....the movie... i went to the internet to look up facts about the movie...just couldnt understand the harsh commets on this movie...ok the race may be not real...so what..wouldnt a race like that be great if there was one...i also never heard of long distance races in general until i watch this movie.i grew up with quarter horses... and short distances races i know of...people are very hard and mean on frank hopkins... you know theres not much truth on the old west in general about anybody...its all tall tales from writers from the eastnewspapers...i watch the movie again...some had to save the mustang,.just like the buffalo...otherwise they would of died away....and cowboys were black in the old west not many whites ..so we have to change every cowboy movie from now on with more black cowboys in them ....to make it real... not the john wayne type of westerns....i myself thought hidalo was good movie..it show the good values in all the people in it that had good hearts..and the bad side in people as well... and how people can change after a hard struggle.... to slam a man whos been dead for 59 years... is shameful on your part....if he did what he said he did or not.. doesnt bother me at all...there probably a man or two like him from the old west that had his beleifs or courage to do what he did anyway..that wasnt notice in writing or in any history books....facts from the old west are hard to find...like the gunfight at the ok corral....or dodge city..or marsall dillon from gunsmoke....i have never read so many attacks on a man like frank hopkins then i had on this movie....buffalo bill didnt do all the things in his life that he said he did...theres no proof what johnny ringo actually did or who was billy the kid.... or was jesse james really kill by bob ford??? i just have to say just enjoy the movie for hat it is...a man coming to peace with his demons and past...not all things should be taken so matter of fact.... |
Stephen Shehane
in Fallon, Nevada
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Posted: Sun Aug 15, 2010 | 10:01 AM
Dan, You are absolutely spot on! I am certain the old man blew his stories out of proportion but what story told by an old timer has not been blown out of proportion? The fact still remains Frank Hopkins did champion the Mustang. There used to be a web site that was operated by the family he worked with it is down now but I think they are bringing it back on line after some updates and repair to it. Hopefully we will get to see the site again. |
witch hazel
in ...
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Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 | 09:29 PM
We just care about the truth, that's all. The truth? You've heard of it? |
Stephen Shehane
in Fallon, Nevada
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Posted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 | 05:48 AM
Yes I have heard of it but I have also heard of people being mean spirited, hateful, unkind and simply down right mean. So what the old man built a story of false hoods, he was an old man. Again, I say go to the University link I posted weeks ago and see what is there. Some of his tales were not that far from the truth. Again, he was an old man and in the telling the stories grew, One day you will wake up an old lady I promise you, your stories will grow with the telling and then you will have to reap what you have sown. Hopkins DID champion the Mustang that is a fact the man deserves credit for that. What he does not deserve is the mean spirited crap that has been exhibited on this sight. |
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Note: This thread is located in the Old Forum of the Museum of Hoaxes.
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