This seems to use some correct references of the Bible to lead people into believong an incorrect passage from the Koran / Quran
Can anyone support this 9:11 passage?
Here is the email i received:
IRAQ - VERY INTERESTING - DID YOU KNOW?
1. The garden of Eden was in Iraq.
2. Mesopotamia, which is now Iraq, was the cradle of civilization!
3. Noah built the ark in Iraq.
4. The Tower of Babel was in Iraq.
5. Abraham was from Ur, which is in Southern Iraq!
6. Isaac�s wife Rebekah is from Nahor, which is in Iraq.
7. Jacob met Rachel in Iraq.
8. Jonah preached in Nineveh - which is in Iraq.
9. Assyria, which is in Iraq, conquered the ten tribes of Israel.
10. Amos cried out in Iraq!
11. Babylon, which is in Iraq, destroyed Jerusalem.
12. Daniel was in the lion�s den in Iraq!
13. The three Hebrew children were in the fire in Iraq (Jesus had been in Iraq) also as the fourth person in the fiery furnace!)
14. Belshazzar, the King of Babylon saw the �writing on the wall� in Iraq.
15. Nebuchadnezzar, King of Babylon, carried the Jews captive into Iraq.
16. Ezekiel preached in Iraq.
17. The wise men were from Iraq.
18. Peter preached in Iraq.
19. The �Empire of Man� described in Revelation is called Babylon, which was a city in Iraq!
And you have probably seen this one. Israel is the nation most often mentioned in the Bible. But do you know which nation is second? It is Iraq!
However, that is not the name that is used in the Bible. The names used in the Bible are Babylon, Land of Shinar, and Mesopotamia. The word Mesopotamia means between the two rivers, more exactly between the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers.
The name Iraq, means country with deep roots.
Indeed Iraq is a country with deep roots and is a very significant country in the Bible.
No other nation, except Israel, has more history and prophecy associated it than Iraq.
And also... This is something to think about! Since America is typically represented by an eagle. Saddam should have read up on his Muslim passages...
The following verse is from the Koran, (the Islamic Bible)
Koran (9:11) - For it is written that a son of Arabia would awaken a fearsome Eagle. The wrath of the Eagle would be felt throughout the lands of Allah and lo, while some of the people trembled in despair still more rejoiced; for the wrath of the Eagle cleansed the lands of Allah; and there was peace.
(Note the verse number!) Hmmmmmmm?! God Bless you all Amen !
Wherever two or more of you are gathered in his name..........Boy was this fun!
zionist
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 11:25 AM
we zionists are making sure that your kids will die for us. who care about prophesies or the bible, we have our talmud and it says, gentile american pigs should die for us and our money. now you gentile (ass-lickers) send your uneducated brainwahsed kids to die for us and keep shopping and stay numb. By the way, we will create as many war for you americans to further enslave you. stay brainwashed.
Viva Fox news, CNN CNMBC ABC NBC CBS holywood and Disney. Don't forget to send your kids to Disney so our zionist executive and molest them some more...Shalom!
The Mother of 7
in Ohio
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 11:52 AM
If the y had only told the truth it would have been enough but you had to lie this is deffientl a hoax
Quran 9 : 11 But if they repent Establish regular prayer and practise regular charity they are your brethern in faith thus do we explain thre Signs in detail for those who understan.
"If Jesus's name was "Bob" could you take him seriously???" - Stephen
There's actually a song called "Jesus' Brother Bob" by The Arrogant Worms. Pretty funny, about how he was always second fiddle, so to speak.
terry
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 02:00 PM
ken - actually not all 19 of them are false. many are actcually, some are stretching the truth, and some are unconfirmed. all my bible verses come from the New International Version (NIV) version of the Bible.
in response to #1, after reading Genesis, it does state that a river came out of Eden, which then branched off into 4 smaller rivers, two of which are the Tigris and Euphrates. so Eden could've been in iraq (north) or wherever the Tigris and Euphrates become tributaries. (Genesis 2:10-14)
in response to #2, mesopotamia was ONE of the cradles of civilization. there were many, like the Nile River region, the Indus River valleys, and the Hwang Ho River area. ALL were cradles of civilization.
#3 is stretching the truth. we don't know where Noah built the Ark and it doesn't say in the Bible. your guess is better than mine.
#4, i dunno. u tell me, but it does say in the Bible that Babel was in Shinar, which was in Babylonia. (Genesis 10:10)
#5, yes, Ur is in southern Mesopotamia. look at any maps that show ancient Mesopotamia or even look in biblical maps.
#6, Nahor is where Isaac went to meet Rebekah. Nahor is a town in a place called Aram Naharaim, which is in Northwest Mesopotamia (Genesis 24:10). Nahor is also names of Abraham's grandfather and brother (to dispel any confusion).
#7, Jacob meets Rachel in Paddan Aram, which is a in Northwest Mesopotamia (Genesis 28 and 29).
#8, Nineveh is in Iraq.
#9, there were 12 tribes, not 10. unless the person meant assyria conquered 10 tribes of the 12, but i'm not sure. u tell me.
#10, i think Amos prophesied in Israel (the Northern Kingdom). read the book of Amos and u tell me if he was in iraq. i don't think he was.
#11, *shrugs* u tell me if they DESTROYED jerusalem. they did capture it tho!
#12, yes, it's true. read all of the book of Daniel, and u'll see that it takes place in Babylon.
#13, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego were thrown in the flames in Babylon most likely. (Daniel 3).
#14 and #15, if it has anything to do with Babylonia, then YES it's dealing with Iraq.
#16, Ezekiel was exiled to Babylon, so yes once again, we're dealing with Iraq.
#17, this we don't know. it could've been further east (Persia and maybe India or China?). traditionally, experts state Persia, but it's tough to say i guess.
#18, Peter preached to people from Mesopotamia and Media, but i don't know if i actually preached in those regions. if there is evidence he did, please show me.
#19, this one is hazy. "Babylon" is mentioned figuratively as another city or place. whether that's THE Babylon of Iraq, we don't know. read Revelations, and you tell me.
terry
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 02:02 PM
in my previous post, i meant to state "factual" in the first sentence, instead of the "actcually".
Right or wrong, at least terry presented a coherent argument, which is more than can be said for many.
Stupid Fucking Americans
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 02:16 PM
Damn you christ-tards are fucking stupid. Quit claiming that things are in your book of fairy tales when you don't even know how to read at higher than a 3rd grade reading level. Worse of all you christ-tards once again have to make up bullshit lies about other religions in order to make your mentally deficient asses feel better about your crimes against humanity and your false religion.
Tessa
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 02:44 PM
Thanks so much, SFA -- charming screen name, by the way -- for lumping every follower of Christianity into one nice, shiny stereotype. Because, you know, a few examples of a group of people will always represent the rest. Therefore, while Christians are discriminating idiots, atheists are all self-centered jerks, Muslims are all violent terrorists, and no one on the Internet knows how to spell or use punctuation. Well, that one might be true.
Anyway, back on-topic, I think it's pretty much established that the message isn't accurate in many respects and is downright stupid in the main point. Interesting though. Also, Terry, thanks for your point-by-point dissection of it, it's interesting.
Shoe fits, wear it.
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 03:05 PM
Since christians are liars and frauds who constantly make things up about EVERYTHING (like this fake verse from the Quran), SFA has it 110% correct. When even the Buddhists are sick of the bullshit lies Christians tell, you know you have gone too far.
DaveO
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 03:49 PM
Silly people. The Bible, Old and New Testements, and the Koran were written with hebrew thought, not greek. Whats the difference? Hebrew thought, in a nutshell, is sort of like telling a story with inside jokes. Greek thought is like telling a story with a logical beginning, middle, and end. So basically, the creation story is sort of a myth to explain things, same with the ark, same with Babel, etc. And the Koran 9:11 "passage" sounds too damn much like the whole Nostradamas (sic) quip that popped up out of the blue. If you expect to believe any/everything you read in emails, go throw yourself out a window. You dont deserve to spread your genes.
snopes
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 05:17 PM
is
disinfo
lol
jimmyjay
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 06:06 PM
And Mormons beleive the 'Garden of Eden' is in Independance, Missouri.
The "garden of eden" is an english interpretation of a jewish (old testament) passage. Many Christians (some rich and famous) misinterpret these passages but rabbis spend their lives studying it. Best to ask a Rabbi what the lessons of the Torah (Genesis, Exodus) are. They were never written for Christians to attempt a literal translation. The lesson certainly is not to go looking for a real place - that's not what helps the followers of Judaism. The rest of the 'Old' Testament is a family tree.
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Revelations was written by a known manic depressive and accurately describes the unfortunate experience. Several times it has come close to being rejected from the bible. Again, Gutenberg's printing press changed history. Keep in mind that Revelations, unlike most of the New Testament is not about the life and teachings of Jesus. It was written much later. Would it have less impact if it was published seperately or in the middle of the group of books (collectively, the 'Bible')?
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As for translating, try this. Learn Italian and read Dante's Inferno. Now read the English version and note how it has no 'impact'. It's all lost in translation. Point being, the bible is out of context if it's an English version. Yet another reason in Judaism that the Torah is not taught seperate from the Talmud (the oral tradition). It's just not theologically correct to attempt a literal-English interpretation.
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Iraq is an incredibly historical place, however, what we call 'Iraq' today is simply not the same boundaries or even the same peoples as in the days of Alexander the Great due to migrations, boundary changes, etc.
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Prophecies can be made to fit just about anything. Follow Nostradumus for 30 years and you'll see the same prophecies used for different circumstances. Same with the Koran, etc. Write these words: "A purple monkey will eat the bananas of wisdom from the tree planted by the joker". Now bury them for a future culture. Fun ensues.
----------------- Eleven-nine vs. Nine-Eleven:
Remember, in the world at large, the date of the catastrophe was 11/9/01. This is because you go from short to long: day, month, year. America is one of the unique places that uses dates backwards. Therefore, the better hoaxes look for coincidences using '11-9'.
In conclusion, to answer the e-mail point by point misses the nature of the claims.
People with a lot of time on their hands....come up with some fun hoaxes for the rest of us!
"Revelations was written by a known manic depressive and accurately describes the unfortunate experience" - JimmyJay
PROVE YOUR THEORY.
jimmyjay
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 06:57 PM
There's a large body of work in this field. Just take a Theology class at your local university or start with the works of Dr. Jamison.
There is an interesting (and political) reason why this book is tacked on but others are missing.
The full name of the book, translated from Greek, is "The Apocalyptic Hallucination of John the Divine". Note there are two 'Johns' in the bible. It is more about John the Divine, himself, than things Jesus said and did (which, for Christianity's purpose, is the reason for the value of the New Testament).
It is not crucial to the religious faith that Revelation stay in the bible. In fact, it is not nearly as valuable as the Gnostic/Dead Sea chapters/books which, some day in the future, may replace Revelation (they are of much more value and interest). Stick to stuff interpreted/studies at the doctoral level of Theology and much confusion is avoided. America is a religiously free country which means you do not have to have a degree to practice. People won't go to a doctor without an MD yet they will learn their religion from men who are simply ordained. You can get ordained online, but somehow it's just not the same as studying Theology at your local university.
One thing that is known is that the text, in it's entirety had more than one author. Nonetheless, here are some things John (the divine)wrote:<UL>
<LI>Heaven is a horrible place (4:2-8)
<LI>The ark (which obsessed Hitler) is actually already in Heaven (11:19)
<LI>Only virgin men get to go. If you are female or have had sex, you can't go (14:3-4)
<LI>Jesus father was actually David, his mother was the goddess Venus.
<LI>In heaven, Jesus was transformed to a lamb with seven horns and eyes (very common in Mania)
<LI>Locusts appear with human heads (common manic hallucination)
<LI>200 million angels decide to kill 1/3 of humankind (same)</UL>
This is getting too lengthy - the research is readily available.
What does any of that have to do with the fact that you said the guy who wrote the book of revelations was "a known manic depressive"?
Which was, you know, what I asked you?
jimmyjay
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 07:44 PM
It wasn't a question. It could be taken as a demand or an invite to expand on the subject. You assumed wrong. But, then, so did I. I assumed you versed in pragmatics. Cheers.
Im not a scholar of Islam but I am a Muslim and I am to speak the truth about my faith.
Surah Al-Tawbah(repentance)
"But if they repent, Establish regular prayers, and practice regular charity they are your brethren in Faith: do we explain the signs in detail, for those who understand.
Obviously this verse is taking or repentance.
Yusuf Ali translation
sleepup
Posted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 | 11:38 PM
The following verse is from the Koran, (the Islamic Bible)
Koran (9:11) - For it is written that a son of Arabia would awaken a fearsome Eagle. The wrath of the Eagle would be felt throughout the lands of Allah and lo, while some of the people trembled in despair still more rejoiced; for the wrath of the Eagle cleansed the lands of Allah; and there was peace.
(Note the verse number!) Hmmmmmmm?! God Bless you all Amen ! :quote
quran verse 2;79 Then woe to those who write the book with their own hands and then say"This is from allah(god)",to purchase with it a little price!.Woe to them for what their hands have written and woe to them for that they earn thereby .ie hellfire
That verse as he proclaims quran 9:11
is clearing a lie as i first of all have study arabic in suadia arabia for 3 year then to reside in morrocco a arabic speaking country and to be marryed to a arab woman which she only speak arabic..
It is a follows as in the quran verse 9(AT-Taubah)verse 11
But if they repent perform As-Salat(the prayer)and give zakat(charity) then they are your brethren in religion(in this way)We explain the AYAT(proofs and evidences,verses,lessons, signs,reverlations,etc).in detail for a people who know.
then also we donot ever say the quran is islamic bible as the bible were made by men over many years
,
If you are going to argue with a group then argue from their position example the christains debate with them their teaching , NOT LIE
If the y had only told the truth it would have been enough but you had to lie this is deffientl a hoax